9.28.2021 Pasco Board of County Commissioners (Afternoon Session)

[Music] good afternoon i now call back to order the pasco county board of county commission meeting of september 28 2021 reminder to everyone present please silence on electronic devices and mute your microphones so now as we proceed with public hearings agenda starting with ordinances p 68-9 item p-69 was published in the tampa times on april 21st 2021 good afternoon commissioners denise hernandez item p69 is pdd210328 it is in an ordinance amending the pasco county comprehensive plan providing for a large-scale comprehensive plan amendment to the future land use maps 2-15 and sheet 22 changing from res 3 residential 3 dwelling units per gross acre and ror retail office residential to planned development on approximately 303 acres of real property located on meadow point boulevard at the intersections of state road 54 state road 56 and beardsley drive and a text amendment creating sub area policy flu 7.1.56 wesley chapel lakes and amanda a map amendment to future land use map 2-9 adding sub-area map 2-9 parens 56 wesley chapel lakes providing for repealer severability and an effective date and i read that all to you because this item is actually was set for uh transmittal today and um it's actually a continuance to the 1026 bcc at 1 30 in newport richie that dates anyone it is in newport richie 1026 bcc 130 in newport richard second i got a motion and a second to continue mr chairman let me let me ask denise a question just to make sure that we're all on the same page we're talking about 69 you said p-69 this was the adoption adoption i apologize it's actually the the adoption is today i apologize i stand corrected thank you thank you mr county attorney thank you so much okay so i have a motion and a second all those in favor say aye aye all right i opposed like that to be continued five zero okay p-70 item p-70 was published in the tampa times on april 28 2021. commissioners denise hernandez item p70 is pd210354 and today is the um adoption on this item so we're asking for you to take public comment adopt proposed ordinance by roll call vote i will read the item into record it's an ordinance by the pasco county board of county commissioners amending the pasco county land development code chapter 600 overland special district areas section 602.8 t voph development administrative review fees and map change to exhibit 602-e vo ph master roadway plan exhibit a tyndall road east-west street a right-of-way alignment and other amendments as necessary for internal

consistency providing for applicability repealer severability inclusion into the land development code and an effective date this came to you for first reading on the 24th of august and it went to the lpa on june 24th where they found it consistent with a comprehensive plan and recommended approval to the board of county commissioners okay we have applicants yeah but if no one's coming up to speak to it i would move approval so no one is in person and no one on webex for this item and do you wish to hear any more from the applicant nope okay so just make there's nobody in the there's nobody in the in the chambers that didn't sign up that wants to speak to this item correct second okay i've got a motion in a second all those in favor say aye aye aye call call call vote district two commissioner moore district three commissioner starkey aye district four commissioner fitzpatrick aye district five commissioner mariano aye district one chairman oakley aye motion passed five zero yeah mr i think the next three are gonna be roll calls somebody 717273 okay p72 do you want to do a p71 oh p701 excuse me item p71 was published in the tampa bay times on august 25th 2021. p 71 is pd 21 0 5 5 4 this is the the first reading on this item it is scheduled for adoption on october 12 2021 i'm going to read the ordinance title and explain to you why we're here on this item this is an ordinance by the pasco county board of county commissioners amending the pasco county land development code chapter 500 zoning section 503 ac agricultural district section 504 ac 1 agricultural district section 505 ar agricultural residential district section 506 ar1 agricultural residential district section 507 ar 5 agricultural residential district section 508 ar-5mh agricultural residential mobile home district section 527 c3 commercial light manufacturing district section 528 i1 light industrial park district section 529 i2 general destro bark park district section 905.2 landscaping and buffering appendix a definitions and other sections as necessary for internal consistency providing for applicability repealer providing for severability inclusion to land development code and effective date so before you um this particular ordinance um is brings is brought to you to comply with the 2021 legislative changes internal consistency and bcc policy so there were um so basically the 2021 legislative session resulted in chapter 2021 178 laws of florida creating section 163.3205 florida statutes it provides limitations and preemptions on local government regulations of solar

facilities specifically it states that a solar facility shall be permitted a permitted use in all agricultural land use class categories in a local and in a local government's comprehensive plan in a local government's comprehensive plan in all agricultural zoning districts within an unincorporated air unincorporated area and must comply with the setback and landscape buffer criteria for other similar uses in the agricultural district so generally this ordinance before you rename solar electric power collection facility which is what we called it before to solar farm and solar farm to solar facility which is consistent with the legislation legislation it also adds solar facility as a permitted principal use in all agricultural zoning designations it removes solar facility as a special exception use and all agricultural zoning designations now it's actually a principal permitted use it adds solar facility as a special exception use in c3 light commercial light manufacturing i-1 light industrial park district and i-2 general industrial park districts district it removes it as a permitted use in those districts and it adds landscaping and buffering for similar uses such as electrical substations distribution electrical substations and solar facilities it defines solar facility consistent with the definition in florida statute and it adds solar facility to the definition of minor public semi-public facility again uh this today we're just asking that you accept public comment there is no action required today this was presented to the horizontal round table and the interested parties meeting on august 18 of 21 we didn't receive any comments from them and it was presented to the local planning agency on september 9 21 and it was found consistent with the comprehensive plan and recommended approval to the board of county commissioners there's no action required today but is there anyone signed up to speak to this item no one is signed up in person and no one on webex okay does anyone in the room wish to speak to this item seeing no one move on to p 72 item p 72 was published in the tampa bay times on july 18 2021. item p 72 is an actual adoption so we're asking that you adopt it by roll call vote i'll read the ordinance title into record pd210499 this is an ordinance by the pasco county board of county commissioners amending the pasco county land development code section 1302.2 mobility fees to increase the mobility fees for various uses to decrease the mobility fees for certain locally owned small businesses to amend the mobility regulations to be consistent with chapter 2021 63 laws of florida and other amendments as necessary to ensure internal consistency providing for applicability repealer severability inclusion in the pasco county land

development code and effective date this went to the horizontal round table interested parties meeting on july 21st it went to the local planning agency who found it consistent with the comprehensive plan and recommended approval to the board of county commissioners on july 22nd and it was uh introduced that first reading on 9 15 21 to the board of county commissioners again today the is the adoption so we ask that you adopt the ordinance by rule call vote okay uh is anyone here in the audience is anyone signed up no one signed up in person and no one on webex okay anyone in the room wish to speak this item seeing no one closer to the board second okay got a motion a second by roll call vote district two commissioner moore aye district three commissioner starkey aye district 4 commissioner fitzpatrick aye district 5 commissioner mariano aye district 1 chairman oakley aye motion pass 5-0 p 73 item p72 73 was published in the tampa bay times on august 15 2021. justin grant director public infrastructure fiscal and business administration item p73 is ut210618 an ordinance by the pasco county board of county commissioners amending the pasco county land development code chapter 1300 capital facilities fees and incentives related to fees section 1302.8 water and wastewater service impact fees amending the name of fees and providing the change fee amounts by resolution appendix a definitions providing for applicability repealer severability and inclusion into the land development code and an effective date the measure for this item is public infrastructure is looking to make an administrative change uh to move the fee schedule for water and wastewater impact fees over from the land development code into the ordinance and change the title of that from impact fee to connection fees pasco county code awareness section 110 39 provides the board with the authority to do that modify impact fees by ordinance or resolution water wastewater impact fees will be renamed into connection fees and they were adopted by resolution um per 110 pro in the chapter 110 process back in 2012 into the land development code and connection fee is a one-time charge paid by a new customer to reserve capacity in the water and wastewater system all right here's a listing of the items that have already gone through in terms of presenting this item to a horizontal roundtable back in july ordnance development team in august and the local planning agency in late august and then on august 26th the planning commission at the lpa recommended the approval of

the amendment and changing the term impact fee to connection fee and the removal of the schedule connection fees from the ldc last time these were modified was 2006 we have engaged as we did back in august right and presented water and wastewater utility fees we engage that same consultant to take a look a hard look at these as well and we provided a cost recovery analysis as well as then a phased-in approach over the next four years and the next table outlines what that approach looks like and so roughly that we'll look at a 500 increase for water and wastewater connection fees or 475 when including reclaim the recommendation here from the board is only on this item to accept public comment for the proposal to modify the term water and wastewater impact fee to water and wastewater connection fee and adopt the water the wastewater connection fees frequently known are formerly known as impact fees via resolution per chapter code ordinance 110. is uh anyone signed up to speak to this item no one signed up in person and no one on webex is anyone in the room wish to speak to this item seeing no one there's no action required all right mr chairman yes let me make a comment um in heaven the meeting and i understand what we're doing i like what we're doing uh we want growth to pay for itself on the west side and it could even be certain parts on the east side if there's like affordable housing projects come in and we're kind of like i want to make sure we're able to look at that it could even be a good business coming in that might may look at this and be impactful so as we go down the road not looking to change anything now but i just want everyone to keep in mind as we talked about it through cbg or other incentives to try to help with someone coming in with a desirable uh something uh construction i want to make sure that we can actually take a look at that and just be aware we have that availability to us is that written in here well nobody's sir so this your these are utility connection fees slash in what formerly formerly known as impact fees um so you would have to find revenue replacement because of your bond bond covenants yeah okay okay all right all right let's move on to 74 pete or oh now it's time for uh procedures mr steinsteiner there are two rezoning agendas regular consent staff will present each application to the board of county commissioners if staff or planning commission has recommended approval and

there is no opposition the application will be considered by the board without further presentation if staff for planning commission has recommended denial or if there is opposition to the application the applicant will be given five minutes for presentation the opposition will be given three minutes for each individual or five minutes for a group representative and the applicant will be given three minutes for rebuttal any individual disagreeing with staff or planning commission recommendation or anyone wishing to object to any condition of the rezoning may at this time request the petition be pulled from the consent agenda in which case that application will be heard under the regular agenda later on during the meeting otherwise all resounding applications on the consent agenda will be approved by a single motion and vote if you wish to speak to any petition please give your name and address and whether or not you've been sworn for the record these are quasi-judicial public hearings the law in florida is that mere public support or opposition of an application is insufficient for this board to take action please limit your comments to those criteria found within the board's land development code all right um p74 do you yeah do you want to swear in anyone who wants to speak oh you know swear people now yeah so if you're here to speak on any of the remaining items if you could please stand to be sworn in please raise your right hands do you swear or affirm the testimony you're about to give is the truth so help you god thank you okay so p74 item p74 was published in the tampa bay times on august 25th 2021. denise hernandez planning and development item p74 is pd21 cu24 in the name of knm pasco 130 holdings llc this item is a request to continue the item to the october 26 2021 board of county commissioners meeting at 1 30 in newport richie and it was advertised as a continuance move to continue time certain second motion second all those in favor say aye all opposed like sign motion pass 5-0 p-75 item p-75 was published in the tampa times on august 25th 2021. item p75 is pd21cu 42 focus forward solutions llc fields farm and this item was also advertised as a continuance the request is to continue the item to the november 9th 2021 bcc meeting at 1 30 in dade city move to continue time certain second got a motion a second all those in favor say aye aye aye opposed like sign motion pass five zero p 76 item p 76 was published in the tampa times on august 18 2021 p 76 is pd210552c pal 21 parents 21 future land use element and transportation element update uh for uh related to airport

zoning and land use compatibility this item was advertised as a continuance and continuance is to the october 26 2021 bcc meeting at 1 30 in newport richie move to continue time certain thank you promotion a second all those in favor say aye aye aye all opposed lifetime motion pass 5-0 p-77 item p-77 was published in the tamboy times on september 5th 2021. p 77 is utsw210643 it's a resolution by the board of county commissioners of pasco county florida setting the commercial solid waste collection rate beginning october 21 2021. uh this item was advertised as a continuance the request is to continue the item to the october 12 2021 bcc meeting at 1 30 at 10 a.m sorry in dade city move to continue time certain thank you got a motion a second all those in favor say aye aye aye motion pass five zero p-78 item p-78 was published in tampa times on june 30th 2021. item p78 is pd217530 it's a zoning amendment wesley chapel lakes mpud master plan unit development clearwater bay associates inc for a substantial modification request to propose entitlements for vacant parcels within the mpud this item was advertised as a approval with continue conditions but actually the request is to continue to 10 26 21 1 30 pm border county commissioners meeting in newport richie and we did um submit a revised agenda memo on that okay move to continue time show exactly it's it's still a public hearing is anyone uh signed up to speak to this adam no one has signed up um in person and no one on webex does anyone in the room wish to speak to this item do you no one move to continue time certainly got a motion a second all those in favor say aye aye opposed like sign motion pass five zero p seventy nine item piece 79 was published in tempe times on august 25th 2021 p 79 is pd 21 7556 is a zoning amendment in the name of eddie perez 6940 main street for a change in zoning from an r2 low density residential district to a c2 general commercial district comes through with a recommendation of approval as as approval from the planning commission and the planning and development department is anyone here signed up to to speak or on webex no sir neither because anyone in the room wish to speak against this item seeing no one it remains on consent p-80 item p80 was published in the tampei times on august 25th 2021 p80 is pd pd21 7558 the zoning amendment 6016 delaware avenue land trust 11836 little road for a change in zoning from an r1mh single-family mobile home district to a c2 general commercial district comes through with a recommendation of approval from the planning and development department and

the planning commission anyone signed up to speak to this item no sir no one signed up in person and no one on wedix okay does anyone in the room wish to speak to this item see if no one remains on consent p-81 item p-81 was published in tempe times on august 25th 2021 item p81 is pw210089 mr chair i will be reading this item into record but i believe that there are some folks that are signed up to speak on this item it's trinity oaks subdivision and thousand oaks phase one pvas number 3436 and it's the approval of a pvas for two million four hundred and twenty six thousand three hundred and five dollars okay let's um determine where people are speaking that can we we'll pull that off and we'll move on to p82 item p82 was published in tampa times on august 25th 2021 p82 is pw21092 mcdonald lane paving assessment number three four four seven and it's in the amount of fifty nine thousand eighty five dollars and we're required requesting that you approve this item is anyone signed up to speak to the side not for item p82 in person no one is signed up and also no one on webex okay is anyone in the room to speak uh wish to speak to p82 p82 yes okay off content off consent and then i'll entertain a motion for the other consent items second i got a motion a second all those in favor say aye aye aye all opposed lack sign motion pass five zero liam divine planning and development this is for item p83 there has been x part x particularly wait a second no we're not on b and three we're going back to the ph one at this point just a minute all right let's move back to p81 is the call the public works um does this be pw210089 next please that's it thank you trinity oak subdivision and thousand oaks phase one pves number three four three six there are 28 streets in this project uh they're account maintained and paved the total estimated project cost is 2.4 just over 2.4 million dollars maximum pulse per eru is 52 297.84 cents the discounted amount is uh just under uh 200 492 000 and the maximum cost per eru after the discount is four thousand two hundred and twenty three dollars and 38 cents in terms of the votes there were 459 possible votes 719 or um 69 responded to the petition of that 189 or 59 voted in favor of the project 130 or 41 percent voted against the project the repayment is over 10-year period and the interest rate is

at 3.25 percent interest this is a location map of both trinity oaks and thousand oaks phase one and this is a typical filter of the streets that are represented in this project okay yeah look at that we have a little sign up to speak to this item we do we have um a few people signed up to speak on this item um some had pre-registered but they are not online so we don't have anyone on webex for this item and it looks like one person has appeared in person now okay so um i have one two three four individuals who have signed up to speak to this item the first person is john hanosky followed by vicky hanosky okay come forward name and address plus uh if you've been sworn they don't have to be sworn for this oh you don't have to own that item okay all right um my name is john hanosky 811 meadowview place trinity florida three four six five five um before i begin i'd like to ask the board to receive and file the attachment i sent you a second okay got a motion in a second all those in favor say aye okay thank you for the opportunity to address the board today my name is john hanovsky i'm a resident of trinidad subdivision i'm here today to voice my objection to our road-paving assessment the board is scheduled to vote on today my objection is to the maximum assessment per property owner that the county has arrived at i as well as many of the people in my community feel the county should pick up 100 of the cost of some of the our roads or sections of roads to be repaved there's a well-documented history of flooding and drainage issues in our area that has undoubtedly contributed to the poor conditions our roads are in my family and i have lived in trinidad since 2000. prior to purchasing my home my brother-in-law and i went to inspect the house and property we were both impressed how well the roads drained because that day there was a torrential downpour there was no flooding or pooling of water on the roads that we observed after moving to my home in august 2000 my wife and i observed no flooding issues in our community even after the most severe torrential rains for the first few years fast forward to 2001 2002 1000 oats development to the east of trinity oaks 2002 and 2003 flooding in the area from el nino storms that led to a 2005 duck slew watershed study 2012 tropical storm debbie caused flooding and with additional deterioration of our roads 2015 rainfall occurred over areas that were already saturated saturated creating

more flooding of our roads so our community community has a well-established history of flooding that began more than after more homes are developed to the east of us i have submitted supporting documents which show that homeowners from both trini oaks and thousand oaks voiced their complaints about flooding and drainage issues issues to this board back as early as 2003 this continued in the subsequent years including at various task force meetings to discuss the drainage and flooding issues in our area and while some improvements have been implemented in order to help mitigate the situation we still experience drainage problems in several areas which will contin which continue to exasperate the deterioration of our roads while we appreciate the county contributing towards rp vas the fact is county does this for any assessment which the roads have been rated as being in poor or failing condition so the real issue is what led to these conditions when you review the history of development in the area it's well known that the county reduced pumping from the eldridge wild well field which has led to the water to lead to the water table in the area rising unfortunately the county approved the development of thousand oaks even though the plans for that development use outdated water table data leading to drainage and flooding issues in our area that we had not experienced before for the past two and a half years i have worked diligently along with jackie beret and asking the county numerous questions about the pvas process as well as what financial relief our community can receive based on our historic drainage and flooding issues i sent an email to commissioner starkey's office on march 31st of this year that included some questions and concerns about our road paving assessment as well as offering some potential solutions to the drainage issues we still experience the answers i received today and received an email dated august 20th 2021 from derrick berger i was told that a consultant the county hired to secure a swift mud permit for an existing temporary flood control pumps also looked into how to best maximize flood abatement in our area the consultant recommended a plan that reduced flooding from about 18 inches in some areas to about five inches for a 10-year storm i've requested i had requested a copy of that consultant's report and after a month i received it this past friday evening i was disappointed to see that this report was issued in march 2021 and revised in july 2021 and yet on august 20th i was informed that the consultant was still finalizing the report i did however receive an answer to my question when would this work begin if approved and what in the time frame and was informed that the cause benefit cost analysis shows that the project is not cost effective and that swift mud will not cooperatively fund a project with

such a low cost benefit ratio of 0.21 also the federal emergency agency's hazard mitigation grant program will also not fund such a program for the same reason so the best of my knowledge it appears that no work to help further to help mitigate stormwater flooding in our areas planned at the current time as i have confirmed with the county as well as through congressman barakas office it sounds like my community's drainage flooding concerns are once again being neglected which is unfortunate but something i will continue to advocate for so now i ask the board why should the property owners being assessed for this project have to pay for roads that were damaged due to negligence by the county and improving the development of thousand oaks even though the plans for that development used outdated water table data negligence by the county and not properly maintaining our stormwater drainage system leading to vegetation overgrowth that interfere with stormwater runoff negligence by the county is failure to respond to the drainage and flooding concerns of the citizens who are affected by this assessment as from what we know today no mitigation efforts in our area have been planned based on the evidence submitted i respectively request that the county go back and reduce our overall assessment and recalculate the maximum assessment per property owner based on the county paying 100 for the repaving of these sections of roads that have been most impacted by our circle flooding and drainage issues trinity oaks boulevard by the north entrance by the school trini oaks elementary kinsmere drives southeast from trendy oaks boulevard to jetland drive kinsmere drives southwest from trini oaks boulevard to tantelon road past the weir in that area pressbook place jutland drive arlenbook drive west northwest from trini oaks boulevard which is the south entrance off at trinity boulevard to mara vista drive trinity oaks boulevard the south entrance opportunity boulevard from the pasco county line to arlenbrook i'm almost done you had an extra two minutes actually okay thank you thank you this is just myself thank you very much and maybe i just wanted to thank you she might be able to finish okay yeah just be sure and start the club yeah okay and i'm vicky hanosky 811 meadowview place trinity florida i also request that the board review the information jackie murray and i have both formally submitted and respectively requested the board approve that is part of the public record on our pves hearing today thank you for your time today and i'm happy to answer any questions the board may have for me thank you thank you for your comment okay thank you i have two more people signed up uh jackie bourie and linda appleby

if miss appleby could just line up out in back of miss murray thank you hello i have to a little older i have to put my readers on i need them i just don't have them with me today i know i know i'm jackie beret um trinity oaks president uh 8115 montauk court trinity florida um i have also uh emailed um a copy of of what i wanted to say so i asked it to be received and put in the record second emotional second all those in favor say aye aye aye before her time starts i'm sorry before her time starts um the gentleman mr hanosky as well as miss marie we just need to get a copy of the items that were submitted they passed it over okay and i do have copies of mine i think he put the copies in for yours um and then i have copies of mine one for everyone i'll try to be brief i'm uh i'm not a public speaker um so my name is jackie beret obviously i live at trinity in trinity oaks i've been there for 14 years four years of that time i was a substitute teacher for my mother of twins at trinity oaks elementary so i'm very familiar with that area this is my third year serving on trinity oaks as the hoa board president this year i've always been active in the community keeping abreast with issues that face not only trinity oaks but pasco county so i try to come up with solutions excuse me as opposed to problems and i want to begin with the unfortunately deplorable road conditions due to storm water flood damage storm drain failure traffic problems and age um we're here because john hanoski and i have been working very aggressively to come up with a solution we want to thank mr caldwell for all of his work we have definitely tired him out over the last two years there's just a few items that i want to bring before the board for consideration prior to approving uh the pr the project as you're all aware as john stated we've experienced a lot of flooding over the last decade um i believe it's due to poor design and a poorly maintained duck slew watershed while improving surrounding areas improper development of enjoying neighborhoods based on outdated flood projections nothing we can do about that poor maintenance of storage storm drain and retention ponds um swift's done a great job in our community working on that basin we've seen a lot of results from it so we're very appreciative of that um however i believe it's kind of the failure of pasco county's um maintenance of the storm drains that causes some of this extra issues so i would request am i done i would request that we have um a copy

of the maintenance program that that is in place for those storm drains um i just want it on the record that mr caldwell stated that there will be polymer an extra polymer added to the trinity oaks boulevard section due to the heavy traffic volume and i'd like that put in writing i would also i'm trying to kind of skip through this because i know you guys have it um i would also let it be known that as he mentioned the roads that are in the front of the neighborhood um those have definitely been exacerbated by the the stormwater so if we could in some way i'm not asking for a 100 reduction obviously but i understand there is a storm water um rate for percentage rate for roads that are damaged by storm water if i'm not right you can please correct that and so i would ask that um i think it's 1.75 your time's up thank you very much thank you i'll need your a copy of the document that you wanted received and filed thank you for letting me speak today my name is linda appleby i live at 8105 montauk court trinity and um i am on the board also when i handle any of the community issues such as potholes electrical and everything like that i will kind of skip go through some of the things that jackie had left and then i will broach the subject of potholes at september the 9th issue meeting bocc hearing mr caldwell noted on record that the additional substance of the polymer jackie did mention that it is a it is our um contention that the community assessment be reduced and yes she covered that as well um i think i think both jackie and john have covered um the majority of the issues at the problems at the moment but one of the things that i want to mention is about the school buses and the damage that's being done to the roads obviously we have school buses we have no choice about that for the young children no problem but i handle the pothole reports and i'm forever calling up and saying please come and fix them and they say well give me an address i said how many would you like because there's so many and it's taken two three four weeks to get these done i followed up this week because i had two requests out there and they actually did them today so i was happy about that but as soon as they do those as we get a rainfall we're back to square one again and we will soon have a big big one particularly um where the school buses come through i mean there was this massive hole plus several little ones potholes and and they were just about to join together to make one big one it is unsafe for the children it is unsafe for our vehicles anybody driving along there both entrances allen

brook and kinsmere it is a nightmare we do need these roads done as soon as possible at an affordable price for our residents i thank you for the time you've given me today thank you thank you mr caldwell uh well let me say a few things but come on up come on up um so when i just for the new commissioners so that those were all the names that were on the list those were the names are on the list that signed up and i have no one in on web experts make sure that there's nobody who's anyone online the audience wish to speak to this item that did not sign up seeing no one um i just i just want to give some of the new commissioners a little history and um and yeah so well this started this yeah yeah and this kind of started before i i was commissioner but um this and hildebrand started putting the big trinity oaks flood task um together jack you were there we used to meet i don't know once a month or something with senator rubio's office and uh um i think was that that the other senator i don't remember his name now that retired no it was a democrat right i think his name bill nelson's anyway we had bilarax's office this was before your time mr carbala and before your time mr biles but um just to try and solve the problems the flooding problems of this community and and this community was built uh when we had over pumping going on in pasco county and our water table was 15 inches lower than it is today and the developer was able to get an agreement from swift mud who permits the flooding and the water plans to agree that that water table was the new normal so that's what exacerbated the flooding in this community and then um sorry but the hoas never maintained their stormwater systems and trees were actually growing up in some of their storm water systems and that frankly is not the county's responsibility in an hoa it's the it's the hoa's responsibility to maintain their storm systems i actually had a put together a meeting with swift bud last last year and i didn't have sadly no one from that community could make it to the meeting so we could help educate them on on the responsibility responsibilities of permitted stormwater systems within a community the county went in and spent millions of dollars which we don't haven't really done in other neighborhoods but we went in and spent millions of dollars we got a army corp special permit to clean out their

ditch and um and i'm hoping that and i think i had asked and i'm not sure if i've heard back uh if we took over maintenance of bmp5 so i'd like to know if we did or not and are we maintaining that because when i drove by there it looked full again so that that's a question but the um the roads the roads need to be fixed i i drove into the biggest pothole of my life three years ago i think four years ago in a big big storm um i i couldn't believe how big that hole was it was underwater so i never saw it and i drive an suv and it was really bad so i think this this pvaas did pass with the majority yes um i know it seems unfair that's that public partners don't pay for the road like the school district doesn't pay for roads pretty sure right um the most unfair one i ever saw was when um uh the the water the branch owned by pinellas county um what is it called well crossbar crossbar the road on the southern boundary of crossbar was falling apart from all the commercial trucks coming in and out of the the land owned by pinellas county and all the houses on the south side had to pay for the road and they're big lots so they had big bills and we couldn't get pinellas county to pay anything so that's unfortunately part of the system we have but this this is a pvas that needs to go through and you're going to do full depth reclamation so the so um there's not going to be potholes in this road again because a pothole only lasts till the next big storm and then it pops out um let's see what else yeah can we see the vote the how the votes came in oops sorry there it is yeah so you know it was it was yeah well or 50 so yeah so i would um recommend approval of the pvas i'm in a second but i want more discussion sure yeah okay that's mr mariano thank you mr chairman and uh commissioner starkey i think you summed up a lot of great points that were there i mean back in 2004 when this thing was getting started i was there with commissioner hildebrand as we were looking it over because at 2004 we had all those hurricanes that was going on so i was directly involved and i want to say i appreciate your leadership your involvement every step of the way because as you got more into it i kind of stepped back and let the u.s district commissioner kind of run with it i think he did a great job

especially with that bmp5 which when that was lower down had a great effect and and increasing the one behind that i didn't know this because the sun shines up but i found out later that as you were working with swift mud to get the timing in there now i will say maybe that could get looked at to improve that stormwater better but i want you to think about something for right down the road look at oak ridge right down the street yeah oak ridge has got the drains all through that neighborhood all the way through and they're after a thousand oaks and it never happens they don't flood now i will say after them there was other development the reserve and they had like a really constrained thing that went through there they opened that thing right up we did some improvements there there and all the way through um so i mean as far as like we've done all the improvements we can do i'll tell you where we get stuck and i won't even blame the developer for this but when you have giant sugar maples that are growing up between the displacement of that the leaves the vegetation coming in there that stuff has to get cleaned out now i will say there's other improvements that can be done that lou fried linen company dan waymar talked about that were right on the money there's a trench that was designed to go all the way through thousand oaks all the way out to the cvs and go through but it's the army corps it's i don't know if it's swift mud so much but i think the enemy core stops us from going through that drainage now i will tell you i just came back from switzerland we kind of my brother and i we kind of drove through the farmlands we drove through a lot of wetlands farms etcetera right through wetlands there's trenches that go through right into lake geneva they take this storm water channel to go through into the water into the waterways and it goes out into into the lake geneva and they don't flood i'm going to tell you i would love to work as hard as we can in the future now that i've seen this internationally done there's no reason we shouldn't be able to have that trench running all the way through to get that water flow out when you look past bmp5 we used to have pumps that would go in there or take them 12 hours to set a pump up 15 guys to go set the thing up and when they just lowered the weir down and now they get the water flowing it works so much better so much easier that's what we need to go do to solve that now with all that said i'm going to say i'm delighted to see it's fdr it's what you needed out there there's no reason to wait as we fight this battle and i know because commissioner stark is going to keep on fighting i'll keep on fighting and the whole bullet supports you to get this thing fixed and i think now that we have more information maybe

we can change what the federal government's stopping us from doing to live you get let you guys have a quality of life so the fdr was delighted to see that that's going to make the road better stronger so you can actually live your life and kids can ride their bikes in the street instead of worrying about what's going on so as much as everything is going on i will tell you the commission i mean this is a great board of county commission that's worked very hard on stormwater issues funding doing whatever we can every step of the way but this is a necessary project to get done and we're still not done but it's i think it's a great necessary thing to make the next door yeah and i want to bring um two things up still um and i you know they finally finished that pace study that you know we had the army corps engineer come in and i flew in the helicopter with him and showed him you know the headwaters of the ant cloak tracing the water all the way through thousand oaks and all the way out we were very hopeful that they would come in and do that project with us and swift mud but frankly here's one of the issues is is that there are i don't know maybe five or six houses and a really really bad storm event in there to get water in the house and in florida and most of the country streets are actually used to store water in a very 100-year storm event i think the streets are designed for maybe you can help me mr engineer but it's very it's we the country uses streets as as water storage in a in a high rain of high water event if we had to elevate all the streets to to a really high level then you'd have to elevate all the houses around it and you wouldn't be able to afford none of us could afford to live in anything so that's just the way development is in the united states and um and so the army corps passed on our pace project which was to hold back the ankle river in a high water event um then swift mud took a swing at it with them and us doing it and they also said that the return on investment is just not there it's better to buy out the houses that flood repeatedly and there's money available from the state to do that and i thought we were working with one of the houses on wavy edge but um i don't think anyone's here that was working on that i think it fell through and that house just keeps selling i just looked it up and it sells every few years it sells but we would be happy to talk to anyone who gets water in their house to sell to sell it and sadly the state of florida is only 75 percent

um that's that's a problem other states give 100 percent but our state keeps 25 of the cdpg money disaster money uh but one more solution i'm hoping for that area and i talked to our folks about a couple weeks ago is we still i think it's i would say bmp8 but i don't think that's right and jack you're the real stormwater expert so you might remember that i'm pretty sure brooker creek comes in and it comes out so because when that water permit was given by swift mud the wellheads were all dehydrated and they they actually and asked the developer to bring water into that area and to rehydrate the wetlands so we have water that goes over to pinellas over on the other side of trinity and comes back and um but sadly i was with someone who owns tarpon woods golf course last night and they're still flooding so the chances of us being able to let them keep all their brooker creek water i don't know i don't know if swiftmark would permit it but we're still trying to find solutions for you guys mr chairman yes i'm just touching and again i think you know we've invested a lot to fix a stormwater there and i firmly firmly believe that trench situation that could be done and i think inexpensively we've just got to get them to allow us to permit it so i'm going to encourage every one of you to keep working with us and let your federal officials know that you want to see that water flow to go through there there's just no reason that oak ridge shouldn't fl doesn't flood and you guys do it's water transformation it's water flow that's got to get fixed and corrected if that gets corrected i think your problems get are going to be minuscule the whole area and i will say as far as the eldridge pumping i when i sat on tempe water i asked them to go pump more out of there just for now but i will say this no matter where we are the water tables are high everywhere yeah yeah and and lastly i know we got to move on i did i those pumps you know i'd ask staff about making them more attractive i we were checking to see i think those are permanent permanent temporary pumps is that right so i don't think they're very attractive they're out on the street like that and i'd really like to see some kind of um surrounding structure be put over them and i think that's good for security as well and just make it more attractive for the community mr chairman yes looking at these photos i believe the most recent photos are from hurricane irma do the streets still flood the way they did since the hurricane irma photo or has the flooding resolved a little bit i've driven through there this year

back all right okay okay let's take public public comment first uh there is no one signed up um in person the person in the audience here that's coming forward i just want to put on the record there's no one on webex for this nobody on webex okay my name is carl darnell i've lived here in pasco county for the last uh moved here in 1978. uh hi jack first of all i want to thank you made your address i really want to thank y'all because we're we're we're every time people try to find faults with you you're judged with one fault that you do right you one thing you do wrong they don't consider how many things you do right you know so i appreciate it uh my name is carl darnell and i'm and i'm 81 years old and i live on mcdonald and i've maintained the street all of these years and i got cancer now and it's kind of hard for me to get anything done we have a hole in the street this lady and and i are the only two on the street that stay there for the year round the rest of the street is good except these two potholes and and so then this guy he comes along and he thinks it's supposed to be maintained by the county but it's a private street uh one time i got a hundred dollars from somebody for doing the street uh i mean but it's it's something to worry that those the holes will be fixing the street because i fix a lot of holes in the county streets you know coming into the house i've i've patched potholes been patching potholes for years uh but it's just uh there's we're the only two that live there all year round on the streets there's only six lots on the streets we still need your exact address uh the military messed up my hearing it's hard your exact address what your address oh 145 31 mcdonald lane i'm all the way to the end of the street mr chairman is is the gentleman for or against the pvas i'm not saying he's for the commission but well [Laughter] if it wants i want to maintain my own street because um okay so you're not in the face but we do a better job the only reason why this is this way what you see on there now is because that i've had the cancer and what have you and because of the garbage truck he wants to put his brakes on there you can see to where that it's been patched with cement before but this guy here you can't blame him because he just comes down you know he just winters here and he thought that the county's supposed to take care of the uh of the street you know right so

okay so i guess that's all i got to say but thank y'all thank you okay yes sir thank you i started saying are you going to speak so name and address for the clerk my name is shirley shull and i live at 14535 mcdonald lane we don't desire to have the county fix this pothole i've come together with four of our neighbors we do have new neighbors on the corner that just recently moved in and we haven't been able to get in touch with them because they went on a vacation as soon as they moved in we are going to have the 18 by 30 area professionally fixed ourselves and so we don't want our taxes to go up and it to become a public street and that's all i have to say wait what does that mean a public become a public street well i mean if you are to fix our street does that make it public oh ainsley says yes oh but it's already public it's all right it's already public when did it become public it is what ainsley said to the commission is this is a type b road it shouldn't be we we'd be having a whole different debate if this was a private street okay it's we don't maintain it ainsley i'm sorry mike but if the people i need ainsley at the mic so it's currently non-county maintained if the pvas goes through it's past and we fix the road it becomes county maintained after the project is done so we are objecting to that mr chairman and yes and i know tim i don't know if do you know about much about this commissioner about the road yeah yeah oh okay i just want to i'm just checking because it was a 3-3 vote but the only two people that are stating that they actually live full-time in the street voted no so i'm trying to figure out who these other people are snowbirds okay airbnb oh there's an airbnb and then um i believe three empty lots which are for sale so they won't be taking on the tax problem that we will no yeah they would it goes with a lot right but the people that buy their lot will take that on we are permanent residents so mr chairman and i don't know ma'am you live at the end of the road you and the other gentlemen live at the end right next door to each other so the people that are voting for it don't even access this part of the road um the the area they're showing is in front of a house that was just recently bought and they were unaware of this so ainsley and stephanie sent them out information in the meantime i learned from our neighbor who petitioned for this that they went on a two-week vacation so they never received this paperwork

on what's going on who petitioned our snowbird fred frank weber so i'm i'm typically especially a 50 50 typically a yes on these uh and i i appreciate you coming here and my fellow commissioners may feel differently but i i do have a concern is that your husband no oh the other gentleman are your neighbors okay my neighbor and he's the one fixing the potholes your neighbor he he i'm not just history he had done that but it's been neglected and frank was frank the petitioner was recently here on a visit and we've spoke and we've talked amongst four neighbors at least that will have it professionally fixed ourselves i don't know how you can professionally fix that without that's just your whole street's falling apart an asphalt company that might yeah that's a pothole that pop was going to pop out every time it rains a big one i do understand that but the picture makes it a lot bigger than it is i was a gen i was general contractor for over 30 years i can fix that so then you you see the road has failed and it's cracked all over so it's not just a hole it's going to be the whole section of road so i am going to be for the pivas i'll just say you would have been there a couple of weeks ago and so your city your your street that you maintain it was worse than this okay and i can take you all over the county and show you places that's worse than our street they're in my mind what i'm saying is this the reason that it's the way it is is because i got the cancer okay and and so i've been fighting that like crazy but uh uh i'll make sure that the the the pothole is fixed myself i've always maintained it okay so for me i'm sorry but for me that's bigger than a pothole that's that's a failure of a whole section of street it's not it's not a pothole give me 30 days it'll be done mr chairman are you are you saying that it can't be repaired by a professional company if we were to hire one i think i think we are i think your three minutes are gone and oh mr chairman we're at the board discussion no thank you i'd like to continue this for 60 days we we have to run through water to get there i'll second that okay okay thank you thank thank you your comments can you explain that to the people yes sir we're going to continue at 60 days so we're going to see how you do in 30 days and we'll take a look at it all right thank you all right thank you commissioner would you like it in november we only have one meeting and i think that's in dave's city continuing to the next newport ritchie meeting at 1 30 or soon there after is yeah the date the the december meeting i believe is in newport richie so what's the target date okay so what december date is that seven so i'm going to continue to

december 7th 2021 newport richard take a second on that at 1 30. motion and a second to continue this to december 7th all those in favor say aye aye aye aye all opposed like sign motion pass okay now we'll move on to p83 item p83 was published in the tampa times on august 25 2021 hi again um liam divine planning and development item p83 there has been ex-parte communication on this staff has submitted to the clerk's office um pdd21 it is a zoning amendment in the name of dmmd i llc and mi homes joy drive it is a zoning amendment from ac agricultural district to r4 high density residential district the subject site is currently located on the northwest corner of the intersection of christian lane and joy drive the subject site is currently undeveloped on approximately 20 acres the applicant proposes to develop 54 single family detached dwellings in conformance with the r4 high density residential district standards the future land use for the site is res 3. the surrounding area is characterized by low density residential several planted subdivisions including oakstead wood lake preserve and bexley and there's also public and semi-public uses and agricultural pursuits access to the property is from joy drive a county maintained local road the surrounding zoning to the north and west is ac to the east is ar into the south is the oakstead mpud to the north east south and west future lane use is all res3 and then access to the site there's an ariel there and this is coming with a recommendation of approval from the planning and development department and planning commission okay mr hobby welcome thank you clark hobby hobby and abby pa 109 north brush street tampa florida i have been sworn commissioners thank you for having me here today the site that you're looking at is located on joy drive staff is pulling up a couple of exhibits that i've provided this morning the site is located in the urban service area and the south market area where the county is planning for and has provided the largest infrastructure to serve growth in the county as staff noted the site is located adjacent to several mpuds including bexley north oakstead concord station zona law and the law and pud that was approved by the board last month most of those mpuds if not all of them

include lot sizes that are substantially smaller than what's being proposed today the proposal today is a euclidean zoning it's only going to be for up to 54 lots in the r4 district the r4 district lots can be no smaller than 60 feet wide so the lots you're seeing here are essentially 50 percent larger than the majority of the lots that have been approved in this area over the last several years as you also saw on the earlier on the elmo or the screen earlier the uh site is immediately across the street from oakstead elementary and there's another county facility that's also on joy drive so there's a number of non-residential institutional uses in the area i wanted to tell the board a little bit about the actual development that's being proposed by my client mi homes the proposal uh would be the houses will range in size from 2100 to 450 square feet and two-thirds or more of these houses will be over 3 000 feet so this is not an entry-level project it will be a credit to the area and i believe will raise values in the area as i said the site is very small it's comparably a small project when looked at the compared to the other projects in the area the other projects in the area will have a much larger effect in this area at planning commission there was i think two or maybe three folks spoke about concerns about pre-existing drainage in the area and i've asked staff to put these exhibits up the exhibit that you see there if you look immediately north and i'm i'm not good at using this thing which button is this top button oops yeah can you show this let's see there's a site right there uh if you see what i've got turned on on that layer the site is not located within a basin a special concern and if we go to the i think it was the previous graphic that had the blue on it maybe there you go you can see that the site is not located in an area of observed flooding our neighbors testified that there are flooding areas in the area and they're worried about some stuff off of our site over at oakstead mpud and i so i want to say on the record since this is a simple euclidean zoning a couple of things number one i can tell commissioner starkey we will have a tree in the in the front yards more than one on a six on the left that's nice i sure would hope so it's a nice sized product and the second thing is uh we tried to have our engineer meet with our neighbors after planning commission and there was a scheduling snafu but i'm here to tell the board and reassure our neighbors we will meet with the neighbors and with county staff after the rezoning to look at the other drainage in the area and to make sure that the other drainage structures even though they may be off of this site if

the county is maintaining them are working for the purposes for which they were designed and we will make sure that we are not exacerbating our neighbor's flooding so so with that i'll i'll wait for any other questions and i'm happy to respond some questions share with this question can we turn these mics up again i don't know why they're so low today i had to like really put my mouth on it so people can hear me ballast stone drive that neighborhood what's just out of curiosity talk about compatibility what size homes are those mr hobby i believe those are 40 and 50 foot lots so you're looking at 2 500. we're talking directly south yeah so 2500 or so square foot smaller smaller smaller okay that that is that's a rental project it's a bill for rent oh is that what that is okay so your homes yeah so you're you're building it so it's definitely we're gonna be high ability gonna be significant larger lots larger homes so our lots will be approximately 30 to 50 percent larger than the last two mpuds that were approved directly across lake patients in larger homes than obviously what you said goes to the south okay all right well um i have a question and something just caught my eye as i'm on google earth is that a nice bike trail coming south of that oakstart elementary are you all gonna it would be good if you can find a way to connect to that um but as joy is joy drive is that a county road yes it is okay and we'll be making substandard roadway improvements to that thank you thank you all right this is public hearing we have anyone signed up to speak to this item yes mr chair we have four people in the audience uh who have signed up and i have one person on webex okay let's call the very nice ones in person yep okay um since there's four of you i'll call you up two at a time if you could just if you're able to stand in line that would be great mr david last name is hard to read is it crowd and jason chrisman yes sir and when you come here if you could state your name address and that you've been sworn my name is david crouch i live at 4115 christian lane i live adjacent i have 23 acres right beside the property and i have some pictures i'd like you to show you you have to speak into the mic sir i'm sorry and if you could also tell us have you been sworn for the record yes ma'am i am thank you sir oh i'm sorry i missed it yeah do you want to you want a motion to receive movement okay you want a question a second all those in favor say aye aye okay thank you

i'll explain the pictures a little bit in my thing here the pictures are to show you where the water comes from and to show you where the water goes oakstead is a major player swift mud and stormwater for pasco county had no clue the damage they would be causing us there are three bubblers major bubblers in oakstead and the bubbler is where it controls the water to flow when uh milo thompson had it there was ditches like he said flood the water my water would drop um a foot in seven days now it's 30 days to three inches but anyway this affects everybody on mitchell road and it's uh 150 acres there it's um let me finish water control coming in the first one when it comes in it's a foot and a half before it can go through so we have to get to a flood state before the water will flow through the bubblers when it flows through now that one you'll see the bubblers where it shows the water it has to be it controls the water all through oakstead so it's a beautification but it's a flooding for us not for them though back in water on lake patient uh flooding houses around metro road is only a part of this flood problem two miles away as a crow flies is a little late thomas and big lake tomlins which um explain how uh the moment i will explain how nederfield's property also was causing a flood issue there because little lake thomas used to flood really bad and then if the water flows through little lake thomas the big lake thomas comes down you'll see the pictures there it comes to drexel the water's coming there it covers about five acres right now before it flows across draxel goes through kinsman's property comes through kinsman's property comes over to mr warren's property comes down and comes through mitchell road which you'll see mitchell road will flood completely even after you put the new road in all that water comes air it has to come into our flood area which mr dempsey's grove is part of it the uh see the three acres on mr dempsey's grove which they say is a 20-acre grow is standing in a foot and a half of water so when they develop that that's going back into us mr dempsey had two groves on that first one that died water problem second one now when he died it was only 12 acres usable land there they're going to tell you that oh it's a good piece of land there's no problem it's going to affect us anything joy is was the old lake patient road that mean that's you that's right thank you for your comments yes sir

good afternoon board i'm jason chrisman i live at 464 on mitchell road right around the corner from where this development is going on i have been sworn in um i apologize i don't have a set number of pictures or something i can share with you i would love to do that at some point but i just found about this particular issue from a neighbor yesterday so i wanted to come and speak a little about it um there was three concerns i have with the development here and i'm not opposed to development but particularly this is a an area which causes going to cause some serious problems one is the choke point on traffic between joy road heading over to 41. i live on mitchell road that already is becoming a problem with additional pieces of traffic heading that way the second is the flooding issue just in the last week of the rains we had in my property immediately around not just my land but i own one one uh 1.25 acres on mitchell road in that back area but in my in my piece of land and the surrounding roadway i had about a thousand feet of standing water between four and eight inches thick uh a deep and uh it took five days to for that to recede so this is just going to exacerbate that flooding issue that that gentleman was talking about that we have on mitchell road and on top of that the third the third concern here is the wildlife so over the last year i've only been in pasco county in this address for two years i moved out of hillsborough county i love this county especially in comparison but one of the things i'm concerned here and the reason we moved to pasco county was for this idea of open spaces open land i could afford a little more privacy my neighbors were a little farther away we've had an overrun of wildlife that have actually had the rescue around this area in the surrounding area turtles i have deer coming into my yard even in the daylight trying to get into my gardens and stuff like that because they're being run out of these areas in these larger developments on the rest of lake patients road there's no place for them to go so you take away this big chunk of land that's in the back by that animal shelter and we're going to get more of that into our neighborhood residents and it's going to cause problems with them going through trashes and gardens and having no place to to have their their their families and their dociles and stuff like that so i'm not um going to elaborate too much on this i appreciate your time i appreciate the ability to bring these concerns to you but i would just ask that instead of just looking at this as another piece of revenue recognize that these are around me there's a lot of families that have been here for decades i've only been there for a few years and this directly impacts our land and the capacity of

this neighborhood to just have the vibrancy to travel in and out and maintain its wildlife so thank you thank you the next two signed up are mitzi uh is it scotch say it again shock okay thank you and brooks uh giglio okay you may bye hello thanks for the opportunity to speak mitzi shock i live at 4602 mitchell road i've lived there for 35 years and just reiterating i'm sorry i have been sworn in yes reiterating what the gentleman before me spoke about first of all lake patience road cannot handle any more traffic it's ridiculous you wait forever to try and get out onto highway 41 in the mornings for work traffic there's no light there which i realize someday there probably will be but at this point the traffic backs up so far it's ridiculous the flooding when we first went out there i mean the water would reseed pretty much immediately now it it floods the whole road on mitchell road and i and my neighbors the the water stands for days if not weeks before it is receded all the way and still to this day from from last week when we had big heavy rains i still have water out by the road in front of the fence there's there's just water everywhere um third i wanted to reiterate about the animals as well when i first moved out there you occasionally saw deer i mean there's a lot of wildlife out there but at this point i have the deer literally in the yard every day all day long they've had babies in my yard they don't have anywhere to go we're just taking up all the space that these poor animals used to live in so my main concern were those three things the flooding the road traffic and the animals thank you for your time thank you very much my name is brooks giulio i appreciate your opportunity to speak i've been a resident of atlanta yes um could you say that you've been sworn i have been thank you yes i've been resident of my lakes for 33 years i know our way of life and i know what it stands for i noticed the logo on all of your signs says this open space is vibrant places problem is we don't have open spaces anymore it's been going on for years we have slowly had encroachment of development after development go in most of them without the knowledge of the residents when i walked around yesterday people on mitchell road didn't know that one was going in they're furious the grove and joy drive as people have said it's filled with wildlife and the development of this or any other acreage nearby will absolutely destroy the animals

i know you've been made aware of flooding issues the current flooding situation is bad ever since oakstead was built at too high a density it never should have been done and now we have the demonstration of the fact of what we have done with that property it's made it ever more important that joy drive stays wild if any of you came and walked you would see it's joy drive is it it's it's a dirt road it's a tiny road it doesn't even have an outlet it has been made the main drag right there because lake patience road was completely diverted for oakstead yesterday when i made my way down mitchell road one mile to the east where that brand new development's going in home after home showed the muddy scarring evidence of very deep flooding mud this thick i saw tracks going through as you've been made aware of also there's 85 acres of class one fragile wetlands contiguous with this joy drive grove back to back joy drive is the only 20 acres around that the animals have left to live on and they need dry land as well as the wetlands if we fill in the grove it's built upon it will exacerbate all of our flooding issues that are currently going on which you yourself said it's a major issue that you've fallen into a pothole that it happens again and again it's going to keep happening we ask that you use the florida the pasco county comprehensive land use plan it was meant as a guide to help you make wise decisions and leaving land in its natural state in order to support the plethora of wildlife that reside upon it conservation must be an important consideration before any more developments are even considered for this area as the man from trinity oaks stated the roads in the area are failing they are flooded they are nearly impassable in addition they are inadequate to handle the current traffic situations and i am speaking of standstill traffic jams twice a daily all the homeowners i spoke with yesterday mentioned traffic jams and interfere with their day even if the light was put up there's too many people in the area ma'am your time's up all right god bless you and your hearts to make a decision for us thank you okay thank you for your comments mr chair we have one person on webex okay does anyone else in the room wish to speak that has not signed up come forward if you have not signed up more to speak [Music] state your name and address for the clerk and my name is becky smith i i wasn't i didn't uh swear in all right do i tell you that i want to go do it right

um wait my name is becky will swear you just where you are right here all right do you swear or affirm the testimony you're about to give is the truth so help you god yes thank you your name and address for the record please becky smith 4749 mitchell road o'lakes they i hope you realize that there are more homeowners sitting in the audience and this is a huge problem i've been in that area since the early 80s living on mitchell road and to tell you that the changes over the last couple years have been drastic and they're right the wildlife is in the backyard our our ground waters come up there's not a house on our road that's not having their septic pumped every day every week it's it's gotten to a point with the area can't handle anymore the the traffic the wildlife and the homeowners are septics everything so how you can do this to us is unthinkable to add more insult to the injury we've already received i hope you do consider this and thank you for your time thank you i'm debbie moore and i was sworn in um i'm a resident of kristen lane for 42 years now um four four one one six kristen lane it's adjacent to the grove we live on six and a quarter acres and david is our neighbor um david is directly to the north of the grove we are like caddy corner to the grove kristen lane runs right beside the grove it's all wetlands to the east of the grove to the west to the east of christian lane and it's all wetlands to the south of joy road and to the north david has an 85 acre swamp north that goes all the way up i thought he said 18 acres the other day 85 acres and if you'll look on the county map even it's like the water comes right to us lands i've been there 42 years and i can tell you i'm the water meter and it has gone up many feet in the pond behind us i do believe it's a closed basin because it doesn't leave and we went through this in 2006 when devco came in and and we were saying the density is too much for this area my husband is edward moore and he did so much for this county and i have a briefcase of stuff that that we were it was denied by your commissioning plan against planners because it was too dense for the area and then it's like the builders and developers they make their money and they leave forever causing us pace destroy our preferred way of life we have to pay increased taxes to repair the roads utilities must be further steady to accommodate this the road just cannot handle it the road goes through the swamp through the wetlands through that grove overcrowded schools cannot handle it there's oakstead there the oakstead school went in and my daughter was in there at third grade next year there are 17 portables out there they're still out

there the school could have some natural kind of little areas to go hang in this grove we should protect it we should buy it i've called land acquisitions i've called natural resources i've called commissioners and and nobody everybody just thinks it's a piece like a green stamp on a postage paper it's not this is a neighborhood and we've been here forever and we have a right to protect our way of life too i pray that god guides you into your wisdom and you'll make the right decision but could you please look at the pictures thank you we are shrek we're defending the grove my husband my husband was in front of trees when they were trying to move this is sean my son oh they can't get my pictures up oh this is very important hello my name is sean moore well um was our currently immigrated to handle hmm you know that held us out the photos this is our backyard yeah oh my god they've got them on our screen oh yeah okay we all have a thing in front of us to see another look at whose house okay that's david's backyard that you're looking at can you pause the photo while they're going through it or does it on oh my my friend wanted us to put a whole map up too of of that area because when you just scan north the swamps that 85 miles you'll see that wet and you'll see these big lakes that are just coming right down that's the grove right there that's the growth okay that's our backyard that's our yard and this isn't a nimby thing this is a save the wetlands of wildlife and our way of life thank you come that's all your time okay thank you for your comments okay please look at that area and make us a wise decision appreciate your help ma'am you can't speak from the audience she doesn't know how to submit them to you how can she get them you know what is there emails well we're about to vote so thank you very much mr chairman i don't know well i don't know if there's anybody else left to speak yeah i was going to ask a question to staff so she wanted to speak someone on webex there's a couple people speaking there's nobody on webex is there someone else wish to speak that has not signed up come forward commissioner and line up right behind her because she everybody wants to speak everybody wants to speak that has not spoken before your name and address for the clerk yes

i'm tina chrisman and i live at 4641 mitchell road i have pictures unfortunately i'm sorry have you been sworn in i have not please what about the lady behind have you been sworn in can you raise your hand at the same time okay please raise your right hand do you swear or affirm the testimony you're about to give is the truth so help you god yes thank you you may proceed um i have pictures but i did not know find out about this meeting until yesterday at the last minute thankfully someone came to my home to let me know what was happening we've only been here like my husband said for two years i couldn't get the photo up but this is my front yard that's completely submerged underwater without any additional building even happening this happens all summer you know maybe if we had known what was your address again 4641 mitchell road so as you can see this is the side of my house and i'm sorry guys i wish i could get these up my front yard is completely submersed my daughter can go out she's nine and walk and it'll come up to her waist this happens when we get several days of rain in a row it's happened in the last two weeks i took the last week to get the water out of my yard we've tried to grade it up as much as we can but unfortunately when we built the home they graded it as much as they would allow before we would have to invest additional funds when we were in the middle of building our house they came and told us that we needed to build it up higher so we had already paid 15 000 out of pocket to do that so this is very alarming for us i mean it's great i want the animals we moved here because we wanted the country setting to raise our girls in a rural area the neighbors are great we love where we live but it has been building up so quickly we already have a neighborhood building across the street that's going to be renting only not even purchasing which you know i work in the real estate business i own my own real estate company i understand how this works but this is alarming for us and finding out that i have so many neighbors that have been dealing with this for a year and they're you know very very concerned i'm thankful i was able to find out but this is a problem i'm wondering what's going to happen to my home if you guys allow this build to happen what flooding is going to happen you know so that's all i wanted to say i want to thank you for your time mr chairman just can she just can you walk around and just show cause it's one since you can we don't is sarah this is from my patio and password county came out inspected and everything prior to your building and they actually yeah so they built our house in a 100 year flood plan so i'm very lucky my house is built up a couple feet i mean i can't leave my property some days i need a boat just to get to my vehicle and i have to

park [Music] to receive those pictures all right i'm gonna motion to receive those pictures that we viewed even though are you gonna email them is she emailing them okay all right motion receiving file second all right i got a motion and a second all those in favor say aye aye aye aye motion pass five zero and you said your address was four six or give us your name and address my name is lana chisholm keane i happen to own the original address it's 4640 mitchell wrote and i happen to own the original mitchell house we bought it from mr mrs mitchell in 67. i've been there quite a while ma'am you've got to say that you've been sworn on the record i've been sworn on the record thank you um i i didn't expect to speak but you need to sort of hear what i have to say um we've seen such a change in the last seven years five years maybe it is partly the water lake patience is trying to be a lake again over the road there's what we call the swamp that was my neighbor i watch her children play in the mud out there it's still trying to be a lake i can handle that but it has gotten much worse we pumped out septic tanks recently that we never had to deal with we now have a pedophile trailer park down on lake patients road where we turn on to mitchell road we deal with that we are seeing so many people now using our road as an exercise baby carriage road that we can't even drive on our own road that's a problem we're so over populated now we're getting a high density rental place being built lake patience is is like 20 cars backed up from the school going through that road opening now to 41 all the way back to oakstead development it's amazing the load of people we are plastered with signs and i want to bring that up to the county we are looking like a trash dump and i just paid somebody 200 because we had friends coming out for dinner and i had to pay to have a king-sized bed and ma and springs take and a queen size bed with it and the box springs with the dog cage in our curve going out of mitchell road is a dump site now with signs plastered anywhere anybody can stick one one snipe signs the yard

the no business signs tree cutting lawn mowing uh anything that people we pasco county you guys are letting us down i don't know why money takes such a precedence in this country over people thank you for your time thank you in response to the snipe signs i was going to say they are illegal yeah so they are illegal but this is the first time that i've met they have heard about that exhibit back up yeah it is pulled i pulled two out put them in my car we made that at least my district i don't i don't know they can't stay steve yeah i'm gonna ask this is clark hobby again for the record i'm gonna ask our engineers our civil engineer and our transportation engineer to come up and answer questions but if i can get back to that one exhibit again maybe i can make this pointer work or maybe dan can make his work show me how to do it so the subject site is right here okay let me get closer to the mic the subject side is right here many of the neighbors you heard discussing stuff so this is joy drive the neighbors were talking about mitchell which is over in this area the closest as the crow flies that this site is to mitchell is over a quarter of a mile it does not have access on mitchell none of the flooding issues you just heard about on mitchell are germaine to this site this site has a jurisdictional approval of the wetlands from swift mud already only two of the acres 20 acres are in wetlands there's testimony about a lot of sites that are not this site but this site is not on mitchell it is not in an area of observed flooding we've had these observed flooding maps for 25 or 30 years and if it flooded it would be on this map it is not on the map furthermore as to transportation and i've got steve to answer questions steve henry but our transportation study the timing and phasing analysis indicates that even with the project traffic with the background traffic through the build-out year the v over c on this segment of lake patients does not even get to 0.5 not not one where the failure would occur it doesn't even get to 0.5 i submit to you all you're hearing here is there are neighbors that have flooding problems and we don't deny that this site there's no evidence that this site floods we will have to follow the rules to make sure that we don't exacerbate any of the flooding off site and i told you that we would do that and you know we look forward to working with the neighbors to determine if there are off-site issues with maintenance for instance in oakstead that are causing a problem but this site has larger lots very quality community it's going to do nothing but raise values and one other

thing just to point out for you on mitchell there are two mobile home parks there's one further up here and the one down here is at seven units per acre seven seven units per acre the other one is about four or five so we're going to be raising the values here we will ensure during the site planning process and the swift mud review process that we don't cause a problem with drainage for our neighbors and there is no traffic problem on lake patients that and i'd like to submit the timing and phasing analysis on the to the clerk on the record it's simply not enough for members of the public to say that there's a traffic problem when they don't have expertise you cannot do that from the mr quite an audience please move to receive and file second motion a second all those in favor say aye aye aye aye aye aye i'm happy to answer any other questions you might have and we have the experts here to answer the questions yeah i just did it's either clark or um the county attorney's always tell me about the euclidean zoning that we spoke of before you mentioned there was clearly in zoning on the site so so what is being requested is a is a euclidean zoning category so it's not a it's not an mqd it's not a master plan unit development it is r4 which means that they can build whatever r4 allows the smallest lot of which is 60 foot wide so that's frequently commissioner the reason why you're seeing mpuds is people in this area have generally wanted smaller lots 40 and 50 foot lots which we're not suggesting here right okay thank you okay happy to answer any other questions you might have again i am telling the board we will be out there with the neighbors we just lost our screens and with county staff after the zoning here to make sure that we do the right thing on the flooding but i can't do it during the zoning process site has to be engineered right mr mr chair mr yeah clark you know looking at these observed flooding maps it's not in it but it's right next to it right the busiest road going to 41 gonna travel along some of the pitches we saw showed water on lake patients as well i don't know what the condition of the structure or the strength of the road is at this point we just did a pre a paving assessment for trinity oaks that with high water tables has helped that road disintegrate between flooding et cetera but if i see flooding all the way down that road i got to think this is not going to make it any better and and if the if the weirs from the and i'm not sure where the

pictures shown that you showed up there or they were that the first gentleman showed of who's holding water back before it can go and get released if all if everybody's holding water back and it's not going anywhere not flowing out like they said it used to flow now it's not flowing um how do we know this is not going to make it worse for those same folks well as you know with the county's rules and the swift mud rules say that we cannot exacerbate flooding we cannot hold back water that's transmitting through the site in the pre-development condition that would make flooding for any of our neighbors upstream or downstream worse so that's what we'll be looking at during the engineering process there was some testimony and another uh rezoning on lake patients within the last couple of years that there may be a drainage structure that's under lake patients that might not have been maintained well and that's part of what i want our engineer to look at with county staff and the planning commission hearing will poon spoke on behalf of the staff and i believe will and his team will be happy to come out and meet with us during that process to make sure that if there's an issue at oakstead or at oakstead elementary or the drainage structures that are in lake patients that they're being properly maintained so the water is being transmitted through the site but we cannot make it worse swift mud and the county staff will not let us do that right reading through the traffic study it talks about different intersections but i don't think it actually references us-41 was that in there and i just made it or steve i believe it does doesn't it apparently it does not have the intersection at 41. all right so you know the most important intersection to the folks here getting out to 41 that's their main access going north south from there right that why wouldn't that be part of the traffic study i'm going to ask steve he would know better than i uh steve henry lincoln associate 3 west floral tampa 33607. uh one of the reasons is oh and i have been sworn yes one of the reasons is the size of the project so what we look at when we do these timing and phasing analysis is you know and the kind of threshold is five percent of level service capacity of the road and once we go beyond that then we start looking at adjacent intersections in this case we're less than three percent of the capacity of uh lake patients road in fact we're only adding a few cars to that road because of the size of the project so from that standpoint that kind of establishes the the study area that we will look at and so in this instance we looked at the segments of lake patients road and then we also looked at joy drive and lake patients and because

of the capacity which is less than 0.5 v c ratio which again your threshold is one that was kind of the reason why we didn't go out any further than looking at that now that you've heard the people speak to say there's a big backup on that roadway trying to get out does that make you think maybe we should take a look at it well one of the things that i guess we're saying is that there's the potential for the signalization intersection which we can look at what that where that is in the cip as far as the signalization right now that's unsignalized and that's part of the issue right now is that it's an unsignalized intersection once that's signalized then the the volume there would not have a problem getting out it's really just the signalization of that intersection well we don't know when that's coming either yeah we'd have to well people pay for those developments pay for the singles though mr chairman i'll have to look i don't know where it's can just follow up on commissioner mariano just real quick just guys we can't talk from the audience no no so the question was asked by commissioner erin about the time this may or may not be signalized and we don't have an answer now um at times there's developments that get put in they actually and they actually pay for the cost of the signal to move the project forward and i guys you gotta you can't you he's gonna have to take you out i don't want that to happen to you can't talk from the audience okay um that does happen from time to time is that something that's been considered uh well no if i might just in speaking with dan the site's only 20 acres and it's like a half mile or a mile from 41. we do not require people generally it's a half mile it's it's a quite a long ways from 41. it's it's this is not right adjacent to 41 and like i didn't know it's that far though okay and again the volume of traffic just to give you an example in the p.m peak hour we've got 21 cars coming in in the afternoon we got 13 going out that volume does not warrant a signal or justify the cost of putting a signal in yeah exactly i mean that kind of volume and you are correct when we have larger size projects that may warrant the signal in this case the volume is so low it just does not warrant the ability to put one in okay thank you okay commissioners um i think he was still going i just butted in okay he was still going i just kind of jumped on i'm sorry i may have i don't know

commissioner is still going i understand but i have a person that called in on webex earlier they call back is that person there now so can we check to see if it's this if it's uh caitlin fisk please okay the person that's um that called in can you please state your name hi this is caitlin fitz okay so it is the um it is the um the person who had signed up for webex and she had she had a call in um if you could please state your name and address and whether or not you have been sworn my name is caitlin fitz my address is two one one one four second street landlakes um and i have not yet been sworn in okay i'm gonna go ahead and swear you in now do you swear or affirm the testimony you're about to give is the truth so help you god yes i do all right you may proceed um i also along with many of my neighbors just found out about this yesterday so i haven't had much time to prepare anything i also do not live immediately adjacent to joy drive i live um a little bit up the road of lake patients second street is a little bit closer to 41. i've lived there for about four years my daughter is raised there and i also share the concerns with the congestion at 41. i've noticed in only a few years the increase in traffic trying to get onto 41. it's become really difficult especially in the mornings in addition the traffic around oakstead elementary is uh increasing oakstead already houses many of its students in portables the school itself is not a was not built to handle the volume of residents that we currently have in this area we just had a lot of in addition to the rental communities being built directly across from mitchell road there were some new apartment developments that were built all of this is increasing the congestion in oakstead elementary so my concern is that adding even more homes to this area which those students would be zoned for oaksteaded elementary we haven't really considered the impact on the elementary school in the area and of course the the high school as well so i just would ask uh for the educational impact to also be considered in addition to the congestion of the the general area thank you very much thank you all right mr mariano all right have you haven't come back forward so so as far as the back to the flooding again i've got concerns about what the quality of the lake patients road itself

is as well um i mean the water table is up high probably gonna stay high from what the folks are saying i'm sure you haven't studied the road i i do our our engineer has looked at it some and is here and can maybe help provide some assistance on that so tell me about the quality of the road that you know hi my name is david fuchsian with the engineering firm of fuchsia engineering and i have been sworn you you asked about the condition of mitchell road uh late patients like patients road is it's in good shape it's going to be reconstructed there's permits with swift mud that the county's already obtained i'm not sure about the timing of that but the road will be resurfaced uh at least to the railroad tracks i'm not sure what goes beyond that um it's has a reasonable level of service right now but it definitely needs some improvements which the county is pursuing are they going to make intersection improvements at 41 as they do that i'm not aware of that perhaps the county staff could speak to that if you like i could find out for you okay um from what you know about the observed flooding do you channel the flooding as well stormwater the the flooding along mitchell road or when i look at lake patients road the map that he's got up right now it shows flooding all along there's been observed i do not know those details sir but i would like to say something uh the areas that the residents have been bringing up which is basically north and east of us that area drains around our project there's a major culvert under lake patients about a thousand feet or so east of the intersection of joy and lake patience there's another outfall to the northwest which goes westward into oakstead there's no outfall that goes through our property that serves the mitchell road and the christian lane area our outfall conversely is going away from those areas it's draining southwestwardly under joy drive there's an existing culvert that then drains on the west side of the school property and under lake patients a completely different outfall from the areas that the residents have raised today but if you would i will i can find out about those intersection improvements and get back with you thank you mr chairman commissioner if i might quickly i mean i think that was the most telling testimony we've heard here the flooding concerns they don't even have the same outfall as the site doesn't go through the site we don't outfall in their direction

mr fitzpatrick i'm sorry thank you looking at the property appraiser map website how much of that is wetlands of the property in discussion and how much is uplands about two acres of the 20 acres is wetland according to the swift mud approved jurisdictional jd that was just done so 18 of the 20 acres is upland and then for the current traffic study what is the current traffic study of cars utilizing that road today and then i know you mentioned 21 cars and 13 vehicles leaving but you would we're looking to do 40 homes on the property uh 54. are you telling me on lake patients you're talking about 54 homes and you're saying only 21 cars would leave what we're saying is in the in the pm peak hour on the the one segment of the of the lake patients from joy drive 241 we would have third again they're going east west on lake patients so we're looking at that segment from joy drive 241. so 13 cars would be going out towards 41 in the pm peak hour and then inbound would be 21. now there obviously there will be some coming from the west also but that's the distribution of the traffic and the impact on that segment from joy drive 241. i know you also mentioned joy drive that runs north and south but what are the main what would the most likely road be utilized to get to that development would they be coming from 54 would they come and be coming from lando lakes we had we we estimate that about 60 would be coming from 54 i mean coming from 41 on lake patients and then about 40 percent from the west on lake patients obviously you might want to explain to her that like patience from us to sun sun like yeah what uh mr hobby is saying is that lake patience currently runs to sun lake so obviously you can get um 254 and other ones roadways from there so it runs basically from 41 to sun lake boulevard so we'd have again we're estimating about 40 to and from the west and about 60 percent to and from the east and again our impact on that segment is less than three percent of the capacity of the road so the impact is very small on that segment of lake patients which is currently operating at a vc ratio of less than five point five in keeping with the consistency with the surrounding residents the ra the residents directly adjacent to this property they're all cl zone a c staff can pull i think the zoning map up there is there is ac in the area i mean the project directly north of us is ac but there's also again their smaller zoning immediately to the east

there's county commercial and institutional uses on joy drive past our site there's there's there's animal shelter and other uses past us so joy drive as it was the testimony from the neighbors indicated was originally the lake patients road this was the cut through originally this was a larger functioning road not just a local road mike that's what the testimony was no talking from the audience but again commissioner it's in the urban service area it's planned res 3. that's what i mean if we follow the comp plan this is what we're supposed to be doing in the urban service area and we've now approved about 15 or 20 000 units in mpuds in this immediate area including we've got immediately across from the site is oakstead elementary which probably has a much much greater transportation impact and impact on the area than anything will do and you've just approved two other npuds with a lot more units and a lot smaller lots directly across lake patients from all these people my biggest concern is the property adjacent directly to the north and to the east because those are all zone agriculture are what kind of buffer are you going to have between from your property to the adjacent property to the north because that's a 19 acres of agricultural north of this property in question again dave fuchson uh one thing that clark did not talk about is the lot depth we don't have a 100 foot lot depth we have 120 plus some of the lots are as much as 150 foot deep we can provide at least a 10-foot buffer along the east property line and along the north property line both of which have wetlands on the adjacent property so we will discuss that with staff during the construction plan review but we have the opportunity to provide reasonably reasonably sized buffers along the east and north property lines commission are you done do the citizens have a say during the plan review do you work you mean when the comp plan and everything was i'm gonna have to leave before we vote well you just mentioned the plan review so the site plan review that we can i mean we can agree to notice our neighbors and we can make them part of that so that they can provide uh input to staff during the site plan review we have no objection to that but taking that their concerns into consideration due to the fact they have 19 acres directly north and then even to the east it's one acre two acres one acre and one acre i mean there isn't there there's no question a lot of the sites that you're looking at north of us have large wetland areas and that's why i submit to you that they haven't been

rezoned for smaller lots yet that i think the neighbor immediately north of us testified that a lot of his property is wetland i mean it's a very significant portion so maybe it's not developable developable i'm not sure but again commissioner we have no objection and i'll be happy with everybody who's spoken on the record to he today and even all the folks that we noticed in the rezoning to notice everybody with our submittals to the county during the site plan review process and they can participate with staff uh in addition to the meeting that i said we would already do with the neighbors on the drainage issues ms starkey yeah um i uh also long time pasco resident and i've been looking at the google earth maps and and i see that a lot of those folks along mitchell there's a lot of wetlands up there and and if you built 30 years ago you built when we were pumping a lot and your land was a lot drier so but i i feel your pain that you have a lot of water in your yards and my house in aristida the river comes up and goes in my backyard then it goes away but it seems to me that we should spend some time with engineering looking at lake patients in that area and seeing if there are any proven improvements that we can do but that is separate i think from this parcel approval this this is not this is not up there on mitchell where the flooding is that that blue line you know that's i think uh i think that needs consideration but not in effect to this parcel i was sitting there asking clark to put a trail to the school and i realized it's right next to the school right so please all you need to do is put see if you can get a gated walk across the street and just walk right there commissioner we're actually working with the school board yeah that's great i appreciate what you're saying but might i also depending on where you go with this i do want to reiterate that what i just said if there is any motion we will meet with the neighbors we will notice the neighbors because i want them to be part of this commissioner i'm not trying to make anybody's drainage worse right i believe we'll do a quality project i i believe it believe the drainage is a separate issue by law swift mud through swift mud rules and then we added on even you know we have another set of eyes over swift mud because of flooding issues in the past a neighborhood cannot flood a neighborhood as a matter of fact what i've seen um in my nine years up here and many years

in the community following development is that a lot of developments come in and they fix flooding problems for the areas around it i can say that longleaf fixed help fairway springs i've just seen it multiple times so i i have no i have all confidence that you will not cause worse flooding in your community you're um right next to the school so there won't be school traffic added on to the road it's less density than other parcels all around it it's not the problem or fault or responsibility of this landowner to fix the flooding issues over on mitchell road that's that's that's a property rights violation right there so um i i would be inclined to um to vote yes but it's not my district but i'll make the motion if if we want to i'll make the motion to approve this have an emotion i was second okay got a motion a second to approve with the stipulations that i made with the stipulations what he had stated that he will work with them and with an additional stipulation that our public works team will work on with mitchell road to get their drainage thank you commissioner i agree yeah yeah and obviously we need code code enforcement to be spend some more time back in their place code enforcement's already out right now very good oh good job i'll remind you i'll remind the board that this is a euclidean zoning so there are not conditions on the reason but i will follow that with him you have my word fitzpatrick i will i will ensure that it happens i will follow up with you i have a motion in a second all those in favor say aye aye all opposed like sign motion pass five zero thank you oh you got one leg excuse me pass 4-1 okay the name was commissioner mariano yeah let's go back to our 85. you got 84. oh we got 84 yeah what's 85 uh position of akm oh yeah yeah y'all handle it oh i'm sorry all right p84 p84 was published in the temple times on july 11 2021 and i'm sorry august 11th 2021 and august 18 2021 good afternoon joanne ravita real property and planning the real property team has received a petition to vacate a portion of a platted right-of-way filed by thomas anderson the petition has reque the petitioner has requested the vacation to correct an encroachment there were no objections to this petition the team recommends approval okay is anyone here to speak to this item

anybody sign up for this item no one signed up in person and no one on webex okay does anyone in the audience wish to speak where is it i'm just curious marion's district yeah but where it's on the corner of bel air terrace and massachusetts oh that's that little red corner that was really yeah how big is it i can't improve that that's literally seven inches by seven inches oh my gosh we had to do that for our house for 15 inches 15 inches our neighbors yeah who figured that out i'm very curious how did that did you answer the survey or figured it out when they surveyed it for a sale that's a good survey i don't know i don't think so let me say it again i got a motion in a second i didn't hear any eyes is he married to atlantis okay let's go back to uh business items i think we're with you mr boss that's too much yes sir i just have a couple things one i think in front of each of you you have a pack of the new uh kind of marketing material from behind the strategic plan that shows the pillars and the goals within them you should have a stack of that uh so that's new hot off the press i think yesterday we got these and we will be working on the action plans behind those uh continue to build up from the plan the second thing i have is the small items sitting on commissioners oakley's next commissioner oakley we won yet another best place to work award this from a local government organization and they happen to send a trophy not just a certificate great congratulations [Applause] with that um and we actually are going to icma so the international city and county marriage association meeting next week and we will actually we are presenting to the group on our leadership journey in the journey in the changing culture here at pasco county so we will be telling our story and telling the count the the story of pasco county uh nationally uh next week hey okay mr snyder i don't have anything for the board hey mr chairman oh yes there was one of the running i want to cover we kind of finished my thing before we broke for the meeting i i was going to go but it's 1202. okay um one of the one of the people commit and i was talking about panhandlers and i'm going to tell you you see them up and down especially the 19 corridor um they're in the right of way if the sheriff's office can't handle it i don't know if we can look at it better if there's another audience to go look at to do something more but i mean it just is it's not good for the image of the county and when there's so many people out there or so many companies

out there looking to hire people i mean i just think we need to do something more well um when i was down at fact um one of the gentlemen i think he's from lake county um that i had dinner with said that they passed that their attorneys looked at the new supreme court laws whatever and they passed a panhandling ordinance that um is a safety panhandling ordinance and it's working well for them so i'm thinking it's it's the vice chair of my federal committee so i can look that up and see what county county's from but they they think they've got a a winning ordinance so maybe the attorney can talk to their own be happy to look at it the issue is that based on that ruling it's safety is probably the only way that you're going to be able to yeah that's what they do something and we already actually sort of have that in place so i'll look and see what they did differently okay from what we've got and i did hear fort myers i think it might have been also passed one too so we can compare what they did sure that was recently probably myers or lee county or charlotte which one is that somewhere down south it might have been i thought it might have been fort myers but okay lee county okay when i was also driving down 19 the panhandlers were in the middle of the road they're not allowed and i understand that but they're literally in the middle of the road you got a call when you see a panhandler in the road you got to call the um the sheriff's office the uh not the emergency 9-1-1 but the other one and they'll come out and get them out of there no that's not happening well alex we shouldn't have to call though y'all should see it right maybe you can pass it on well let's let's let's uh alex you want to come for a minute sorry i know you were there still i mean if they're in the right of way and a deputy's driving by is are they looking at them are they talking to them because i mean i see them continually beakers drive us 15 19 and 52 further down the road at uh other intersections they're continually out there so alexander intergovernmental affairs officer for the pasco sheriff's office so yeah so if they are in the right of way if they are not impeding the flow of traffic or causing a safety concern with traffic then there isn't a trespassable issue there with them being in the right of way now if they are crossing into the street like commissioner stocky was saying then yes that would be a safety concern there if they are impeding the flow of traffic

and standing out in the road yes but not just the right away on its own but they can't stand in the median so as long as they're not impeding the flow of traffic or causing a safety concern by standing there then under this ruling they are allowed to with the it's a protected first amendment right that under this ruling is there any speed limit requirements of a median that's safe to stand in i i'm not sure that one i can i can double check if there is but i'm not sure if there's a speeding requirement there especially with the width of the median if the median's only two feet wide i mean that's eight feet and the gentleman that i saw person that i saw in the middle of the road they were literally in the middle of the road on the dotted lines okay so then if that's if they're in the road in that case then yes that could be something that as the commissioner was saying you can call and let us know that they're out there and if we get out there and they're still there and they're causing a safety concern there then we can address it and to the commissioner mariano's point they would go out there and try to talk to them first off the services to get them out of that location so they're not there anymore and they'll go through that process of trying to help them so they're not going back out there on a daily basis but the issue is if someone calls and you don't see them in the middle of the road and that's that's the thing with florida statute it requires that we witness it so we have to go out and see it so we get a report we'll go investigate the report of of a concern like this and we have to get out there and see it happening and that comes back to deputizing some of our code code enforcement officers not only to maybe enforce this or enforce the illegal boating on lakes or also to enforce the illegal handicap parking or parking on the handicapped stripes so the question is commissioner the question is really not if the code enforcement deputies do not have to be code enforcement officers um do not have to be deputized by the sheriff to enforce county ordinance that's their job and i don't think the sheriff is going to be deputizing code enforcement officers to enforce state statute because that's their job so and what about the handicapped parking if someone's illegally parked in handicap parking because i know i've had

this conversation with staff so uh commissioner for handicap parking that's another that's something else that if there's a report of it and we got a call about it we would investigate and look into if we catch somebody parking illegally in handicap parking then that would go through like the ticketing or citation process and then the last one would be for an example on moon lake when they have people that are breaking the law going around the buoys and things like that if we already have a code enforcement officer on scene daily then why not deputize one of them so we don't have to just call law enforcement every time if they're already at the park um so i i haven't spoken with the sheriff on on deputizing uh code enforcement so i'm not i can't speak to that but um if we do see if we're out there and we do see or we get a report of people doing things like that that is something we would investigate and look into and uh if either again the first thing we would try to do is educate and let them know if make sure they're aware they're doing something incorrect or they're not supposed to be doing that if there's if it's a continual issue then that would go forward with if a citation is required or something like that it's a continuing issue especially when we have to keep replacing the buoys at county expense because people are out there illegally damaging county property so and again that's why i'm mentioning it because they're already at the location of the violations uh and i would be happy to share that with our um with our marine unit so they're aware at that location you said that's moon lake correct gotcha okay mr chairman okay i'll just ask um so from what i'm hearing from what our county attorney just said our code enforcement can enforce this panhandling audience so i would like to see our code enforcement team take it off the sheriff's burton and every every time we see one if we want to call it in that we have a code enforcement person go out and let them go enforce it now i didn't say that the the code the panhandling ordinance that you have that basically is in violation of the supreme court order you can send code enforcement out to to enforce that's not what i said well okay you didn't go that far but you did say our code enforcement can enforce our ordinances or our ordinances yes but the reason the sheriff is not enforcing this is it is the one that you've got on the books was basically struck down it and will be struck down

if you if you try and enforce it okay then i'm going to ask you to go check those other orders bring another one back that will work um last last just two things um commissioner moore thank you for bringing it up as far as the uh waiver of the fees for the cares it's a great event october 16 and 17 the cair's beach charity festival at sunwest park should be an awesome time there's another one coming up november 12 13 and 14 sariah fest and that should be another one another good one as well thank you very much thank you hey got everything madam clerk um i don't have anything thank you okay um i don't really have anything either except for one thing i thank everybody for doing their job i think for all staff and all of our employees that do their job each and every day because without y'all doing that this county wouldn't become closer and closer to being a premier county so i would like to announce that [Music] chuck carridon has been selected as general manager for tampa bay water which is he started out in pasco county his first six years working was in pasco county and he's been with tampa bay water ever since and this past week just became the general manager for tampa bay water so it's a very good move and we look forward to working with him and he's he's been reaching out to us he'll he'll actually be coming out to uh speak to the board from time to time so we'll appreciate that that that's all i have and chairman nope i know i mentioned it but i thought that mr viles was gonna go so i didn't want to interrupt before oh but he's the i had a couple additional okay from if you can pull up the photos i had a couple photos of the care fest which this was the before photo and then after was cleaning help and clean up the yard so that they can utilize the different the dogs and go outside with the handicapped and disabled there was a lady in a walker that wasn't able to tend to her yard so it was nice to see the different organizations and churches go out and help clean up the yards for these people and then the next photos were from palm beach and just some of the roadways and that was the median in the middle of the road where you can't even see the other side and then of course the roadways on the side of the road

when you have the different developments you still have the nice greenery and landscaping i wanted to thank my carbalas team and donald curry because i had an elite go pass project with the flood of mitigation and it's moving forward to the next steps of design permitting construction so they are happy and excited about that and i would like to know i don't know if we have an update i had rescinded the motion to remove the chip seal and to move forward with the full depth reclamation for arecita and i didn't know what the pro where we were on that so we met briefly with the aristida hoa a couple of weeks ago i believe and public works was going to meet on site with the hoa representatives to get some of the major drainage issues addressed and looking at those first before we move forward with any sort of pvas okay thank you and lastly i did as running the numbers and looking through the budget um do you have the slide because it was looking we could save possibly 1.8 no you don't have to show that i want it on a pdf um okay so looking at the numbers for a fire rescue if we're paying 12 additional average additional time and a half salaries a day that consists of 1096 dollars and 80 cents per day for 12 firefighters to work time and a half which is 13 000 roughly a day multiplied by 365 days a year that would mean we're paying overtime in 4.8 million dollars now if we were to take those 12 people multiply it by the seven days and divide it by the two point three three so you would long story short you would get 36 news employees full-time employees their loaded benefits would be eighty two thousand three hundred and ninety one dollars which would mean thirty six employees multiplied for the loaded benefits would be two point nine million dollars it would be a cost savings for our residents of one point eight million dollars so one million eight hundred and thirty seven thousand nine hundred eight dollars so i would like to look at the cost and even if we reallocated the 1.115 million dollars of the overtime costs for the firefighters for their overtime and hire the new employees it would be moving the line items over but we would be having the additional savings of up to 1.8 million dollars so i would like to take time to look at that or reconsider it next time at the board meeting to move forward i just have a question can you just out of curiosity is that so we're all aware where exactly did you get that information from and who did you get it from i was speaking with

chief cason and i was looking at it was originally an average of nine people and it was an average of nine overtime employees if they were if someone had called out they would have to go and ask for volunteers if there were not volunteers they would have to do a mandate instead of having a 24-hour shift on and a 48-hour shift off they were working additional days so instead of them working at 24 they were working a 48-hour shift and then we would end up having to pay them an additional 1096 dollars a day and if we have an average of 12 people calling in and we're having to fill those in with other firefighters for overtime we're paying 13 000 a day in overtime which accumulates to 4.8 million dollars a year so instead of paying all of that overtime if we were able to hire 36 employees at 82 000 and loaded benefits it would be 2.2 million 966 0.76 which would be the total savings cost of one million eight hundred and thirty seven thousand nine hundred eight dollars so this is a request from chief casten to you to bring to the board no this is me going in asking questions looking at numbers and how to save funds across the board especially but the information came directly from chief kassan and i called other people to who else did you talk to at a curiosity that gave you those numbers i have an email from chief cason regarding because i specifically asked what is the loaded cost of an employee and then i calculated the numbers on what is because i was really curious about the break-even analysis and what would the break-even analysis be from us having to pay overtime to having additional employees and really if we were to hire the amount of we paid in overtime we would have probably 50 employees okay so i was just curious i just wondered where not that your numbers are wrong by any means i just wonder where they came from since they're not just the average numbers came from public realm you know steve cass on that okay and then it was originally around 78 000 but i did get confirmation that the load of benefits was 82 391 and i even had it broken up for 12 people average per day is dollars and 70 cents per hour and i took that multiplied by 24 hours shifts that they have to work which is 1096 dollars and 80 cents and then you have multiply that by the 12 people multiplied by the 365 days a year and hr confirmed those numbers human resources i will confirm with hr i'm just curious

that's the way we know i mean i'm pretty special might be able to step in but we looked at this as part of the budget process and there is a variance of overtime that is going to exist regardless of how many firefighters we hire to do the 24 hour 48 shift and so the average is nine call outs a day which is less than five percent of the workforce every day which is well within the industry average variance for call outs in a day we work through the numbers the the challenge is there is many days where you're over that as you're under that which means you will then be hiring people that you will have on shift which aren't filling a role that day because the nine is an average sometimes it can be higher sometimes it could be two and so you still have people you've hired now that are on shift and aren't actually filling a role in a fire station so we we work through these numbers between the fire rescue and the budget and are comfortable with what we're recommending that you will see and hopefully vote on this afternoon at 5 15. we will continue to work on them every year like we do starting in about january to continue to work on the budget and see what changes we need to make to see if there are other efficiencies but in general you know what we have is been vetted between fire rescue and budget to to to deliver the best product that we can for the resources given to them and do you have the number for the actual overtime expense that we paid out for last year because if we can hire additional firefighters and reduce the number of overtime by finding that break-even analysis we could save our citizens like i said fire rescue and budget worked through all that math and looked at it there is a variance of overtime you are going to have every day if i hire 30 firefighters to cover the nine and i have zero call outs then what do i do with the nine firefighters they're supposed to be on duty that day well there's an average of three people three firefighters per fire truck and i believe per standard it's actually supposed to be four so if we did have additional people we could add them to an additional fire truck or as we grow instead of hiring new firefighters at that time we can put them into the new fire stations and already have them prepared vetted and knowing what's what at the different locations i said you have our recommendation we will look at this as part of the budget process again next year and we will make adjustments as needed as we look at efficiencies in the

process so my only concern is if we're paying out four million dollars and over time when we can hire the additional staff and save two million dollars then why would we not do that i don't think that's a real number based on our analysis that we've done with our rescue and budget i'll be more than happy to share the numbers and with everyone all right is that everything thank you yes okay cool i think this means adjourn see you here don't go very far 5 15. just a warning